| 'I trusted them.' Some 'Build the Wall' donors feel cheated by Bannon. Some don't care. Posted: 22 Aug 2020 07:51 AM PDT  More than 250,000 people gave money to the We Build the Wall campaign, which raised millions for private construction of a border wall. According to federal prosecutors, they were defrauded by campaign leaders, including Steve Bannon.
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| French government condemns vandalism at site of Nazi massacre Posted: 22 Aug 2020 10:51 AM PDT  French government officials on Saturday said they would work to track down those responsible for defacing a memorial to the victims of a Nazi massacre during World War Two, which was painted over with graffiti calling the killings a lie. The site, at the village of Oradour-sur-Glane near the western city of Limoges, commemorates the hundreds of men, women and children who were killed in June 1944 by an SS division. Prime Minister Jean Castex said in a statement that everything would be done to bring those behind the "disgraceful acts" to justice.
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| 'You now have COVID': Massachusetts police hunt suspect who gave shoppers 'coronavirus hugs' at a Walmart Posted: 23 Aug 2020 06:54 AM PDT  Springfield police said that the man walked up to one shopper, hugged him, and then said: "Just giving you a COVID hug," then laughed.
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| 2 tropical storms a potential double threat to Gulf Coast Posted: 22 Aug 2020 08:27 AM PDT  Tropical Storms Laura and Marco are projected to reach the Gulf Coast at or near hurricane force, with the current track taking them to Texas or Louisiana.
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| New Tennessee Law Severely Sharpens Punishments for Some Protesters, Potentially Endangering Their Voting Rights Posted: 23 Aug 2020 02:17 PM PDT  It makes it a felony for protesters to camp out overnight on state property, and felons can't vote in Tennessee
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| Most Russians Say ‘Hell, No!’ They're Not Taking Putin’s COVID-19 Vaccine Posted: 22 Aug 2020 02:11 AM PDT  MOSCOW— Vladimir Putin has registered the world's first state-approved vaccine against the coronavirus and probably expected congratulations—at least at home—for winning the global race for a vaccine, but even Russians aren't so sure this is a good idea.Epidemiologists, pharmacologists, and doctors in Russia have responded to the alleged breakthrough with skepticism, and they certainly aren't lining up to be injected first.Russian scientists plan to start the final stage of the trials on Monday, planning to begin the mass vaccination in October. Siberian scientists in the city of Novosibirsk are offering thousands of volunteers $1,997 for giving the vaccine a try, Znak news website reports. That is a lot of money for Novosibirsk, where the average monthly wage is $519. Many fear it is dangerous to open the vaccine to the public weeks before the third-stage trials are completed. "It seems that five months for the creation of such an important drug is too short a time," an article in popular newspaper Kommersant noted on Friday. The whole enterprise evokes Soviet-era scientific experimentation which included many great advances but sometimes carried a deadly price tag, from botched vaccines and accidental leaks from weapons labs, to the nuclear meltdown at Chernobyl.The Real Reason Behind Russia's COVID-19 Vaccine HacksTo promote the world-first vaccine, Putin has boasted that one of his own daughters was among the first to volunteer. The authorities want thousands more Russians aged between 18 and 60 to follow suit. The Daily Beast asked Russian doctors, scientists, business leaders, artists, housewives, and pensioners whether they would dare to take the untested, but potentially life-saving vaccine.The president of the Russian Society of Evidence-based Medicine, Dr. Vasily Vlasov, said he had no plans to use the vaccine, nor would he recommend it to his friends or family. He sounded frustrated, explaining that there was no way to examine any of the findings from the first two stages of the trials. "They announced the vaccine was ready; but the creators still have not published the actual results of their research," he said. "Everything is based on some unclear protocols and the longer they delay publishing, the more doubts people will have."The research looked a lot like a secret military operation from the start. The vaccine, created by a team of experts from the Russian Defense Ministry and the Gamaleya Institute, is called Sputnik V, in honor of the Cold War-era space-race winning satellite, which has also given its name to one of Russia's leading state-operated propaganda news sites.Leading epidemiologists and a trade group for medical experiments, the Russian Association of Clinical Trials, publicly urged the Kremlin to delay the vaccine's registration, but they were ignored. Some scientists warned that it was possible Sputnik V could even make the disease more virulent in those who have been vaccinated.The number of Sputnik volunteers remains unclear. Some sources suggest that just 76 people took part in trials, others said hundreds had been given the vaccine—some of them unofficially—before formal registration. Russian epidemiologists have been forced to rely on rumors: "Since the second phase was conducted by the Defense Ministry, everything's kept as a big secret," said Mikhail Favorov, an epidemiologist, who is worried about potential side effects. "Once the vaccine's been administered, there is nothing to be done—that's what is awful.""This vaccine is made of politics," said Alexander Nevzorov, a well-known radio observer. "This is a pharmacological record. Thirty eight people tried it, while the entire world says that 5,000 is not enough—this is both a record and a record of absolute impudence [arrogance?]."Normal life has been returning to Russia after lockdown: local tourism is booming and passengers are crowding onto planes, many without masks on. Moscow's restaurants, gyms and galleries are once again buzzing with visitors, though every day, the capital reports between 600 and 700 new cases. There is no doubt that an effective vaccine is needed here, just as it is in the rest of the world.To try to attract Russians to take the Sputnik V vaccination, the government invited the editor-in-chief of Echo of Moscow, Aleksey Venediktov, to try the vaccine. In a broadcast, he said he had declined. So did Venediktov's deputy, Olga Bychkova: "I don't want to become a guinea pig for these medical experiments," she told The Daily Beast.The Kremlin has high hopes for Sputnik V—imagining that it could capture as much as a quarter of the world's demand for a coronavirus vaccine, which would make $75 billion, according to the business newspaper Vedomosti.Denis Logunov, one of the Russian vaccine's creators, explained that the accelerated registration was needed "so that people from the risk group could participate in the study." That explanation brought no comfort to people with family members in at-risk groups. "My son, a scientist researching COVID, will not let me get vaccinated with Sputnik V, since the reaction could poison me," said Olga Frolova, a 67-year old pensioner.Many feel Russia should at least wait until some of the early volunteers have been exposed to the coronavirus and the effectiveness of the vaccine is properly tested. One of Lukoil's top managers, Vasily Zubakin, had a simple explanation for his decision to wait: "Being in the at-risk group at 61, I am simply afraid," he said.There is a deep-rooted public respect for doctors and scientists in Russia. Research conducted by the Higher School of Economics a few years ago asked what occupations people personally respected, and 41 percent named doctors as the most respected professionals. Yet for generations, authorities made doctors cover up a record of bad side effects to vaccines in the Soviet Union. "For decades, the Soviet government kept post-vaccine medical complications a secret. It wasn't until 1998 that the Russian Health Ministry drew up compensation laws," Vlasov told The Daily Beast. "I remember children suffering from cysts, and infected bones after Soviet vaccination against TB. We still have many questions about coronavirus."Among the Moscow elite, pop stars, film directors, radio and TV presenters all fear the impact of the coronavirus on their work. Theaters, which are at the heart of Russia's cultural life, are about to open their doors for the new season.Keeping the virus at bay is crucial for thousands in the entertainment industry, but many remain skeptical. "For now both me and all my friends feel doubtful about the creation of this vaccine, the fuss around it," popular comedian and choreographer, Yekaterina Varnava, told The Daily Beast. "At least eight months of trials should pass before it truly becomes real, legit; it's unclear how they suddenly made it work."Read more at The Daily Beast.Get our top stories in your inbox every day. Sign up now!Daily Beast Membership: Beast Inside goes deeper on the stories that matter to you. Learn more.
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| New York blocked a wedding with 175 expected guests from being held this weekend Posted: 22 Aug 2020 09:47 AM PDT  A federal appeals court Friday granted New York's attempts to block weddings from having more than 50 people, allowing the court fight to continue.
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| Billionaire Investor Leon Black will be subpoenaed in Jeffrey Epstein Case: NYT Posted: 23 Aug 2020 11:38 AM PDT  Billionaire investor, Leon Black, will be forced to hand over financial statements and tax returns, The New York Times reported.
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| 'End of the world': Countdown to Beirut's devastating blast Posted: 22 Aug 2020 11:11 PM PDT  The 10 firefighters who received the call shortly before 6 p.m. — a big fire at the nearby port of Beirut — could not know what awaited them. The brigade of nine men and one woman could not know about the stockpile of ammonium nitrate warehoused since 2013 along a busy motorway, in the heart of a densely populated residential area — a danger that had only grown with every passing year. The stockpile was degrading; something must be done.
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| Newly resurfaced video reveals Steve Bannon accidentally previewing his own arrest Posted: 22 Aug 2020 01:00 AM PDT  Bannon jokes about being on a yacht in the south of France and paying for it with We Build the Wall donations
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| Hospital staff members say they can't get coronavirus tests, are forced to reuse PPE Posted: 22 Aug 2020 01:43 AM PDT  "It was chaos and it continues to be very chaotic," a union leader said, calling on Gov. Gavin Newsom to issue new COVID-19 safety rules for hospitals.
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| Deputy campaign manager confirms Biden still hasn't been tested for coronavirus Posted: 23 Aug 2020 08:34 AM PDT  Former Vice President Joe Biden, the Democratic presidential nominee, still has not been tested for the coronavirus, his deputy campaign manager Kate Bedingfield told George Stephanopoulos on Sunday's edition of ABC's This Week.Biden confirmed he hadn't been tested earlier this summer, but the campaign had refused to answer to the question this week during the Democratic National Convention before Bedingfield clarified the matter Sunday. She insisted Biden has not had the virus and that the "strictest protocols" are in place for the nominee, noting that everyone around Biden and his running mate, Sen. Kamala Harris (D-Calif.), is "undergoing the appropriate testing."> NEW: "He has not been tested; however, we have put the strictest protocols in place," Biden deputy campaign manager Kate Bedingfield tells @GStephanopoulos when asked if Joe Biden has been tested for COVID-19. https://t.co/P6iz1jjwYE pic.twitter.com/flY9bWMJ6x> > — This Week (@ThisWeekABC) August 23, 2020The revelation implies that Biden technically didn't follow the protocols others were required to follow if they entered the sparsely populated convention venue in Wilmington, Delaware, where Biden gave his acceptance speech Thursday.> What this means: Biden did not follow the health and safety protocols that others were required to follow to enter the convention venue in Wilmington https://t.co/q3PBl6lQEc> > — Thomas Kaplan (@thomaskaplan) August 23, 2020Bedingfield did say if there's any reason for Biden to get a COVID-19 test in the future, he certainly will. Read more at The Hill.More stories from theweek.com The Trump show has jumped the shark The only way Trump can win 6 things the GOP can learn from the virtual DNC
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| As the Puerto Rican town of Guánica braces for a tropical storm, the earth shakes again Posted: 22 Aug 2020 02:13 PM PDT  Michelle Morales was washing dishes in her home in the Puerto Rican municipality of Guánica Saturday morning when the earth began to tremble.
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| Fact check: Barack Obama did not spend $65K on prostitutes, code-named 'pizza' and 'hotdogs' Posted: 23 Aug 2020 02:31 PM PDT  The claim is based on an unsubstantiated conspiracy theory supported by QAnon and InfoWars. We rate it false.
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| Kremlin critic Navalny 'stable' in Berlin hospital Posted: 22 Aug 2020 06:42 AM PDT  Leading Kremlin critic Alexei Navalny, who has suffered a suspected poisoning, was in a stable condition in hospital on Saturday after being flown to Berlin following a standoff over his medical evacuation from Russia.
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| AP Explains: Why revolt in Belarus is different from Ukraine Posted: 23 Aug 2020 12:49 AM PDT  A former Soviet republic on the fault line between Russia and Europe is boiling with revolt this summer. The uprising in Belarus erupted last week in a democratic vacuum, in a country where challengers to President Alexander Lukashenko are jailed or exiled and where there is no experienced parliamentary opposition.
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| 'Is this a joke?' North Carolina voters are being mailed absentee ballot request forms with Trump's face on them Posted: 22 Aug 2020 04:21 AM PDT  President Trump has criticized mail-in voting for months, baselessly asserting that it will lead to voter fraud.
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| Why a Somali-born fighter is being honoured in Rome Posted: 23 Aug 2020 02:47 AM PDT  Some Italians are revaluating their colonial past in East Africa, writes Ismail Einashe.
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| Venezuela’s Maduro thanks Iran for helping oil industry overcome U.S. sanctions Posted: 23 Aug 2020 09:54 AM PDT  Venezuelan President Nicolas Maduro on Sunday thanked ally Iran for helping the South American country overcome U.S. sanctions on its oil industry and floated the idea of purchasing missiles from the country. Washington maintains strict sanctions against Iran's oil industry to try to halt the country's nuclear program. Earlier this year, Tehran sent several gasoline cargoes to Venezuela to help it overcome fuel shortages, as well as equipment to help state oil company PDVSA repair its dilapidated refineries.
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| What would a Biden economy look like? Posted: 23 Aug 2020 02:40 AM PDT  The smartest insight and analysis, from all perspectives, rounded up from around the web:If you're wondering what a Biden presidency would mean for the economy, look to Biden's last financial crisis, said Jeffrey Taylor at Bloomberg. In 2009, as vice president, Biden approached the crisis from a middle-class, Rust Belt viewpoint, aggressively pushing for an auto bailout while championing tighter restrictions on banks and arguing against Wall Street in key debates. While today's situation is obviously different from the Great Recession, Biden sees "common threads" that could help him pursue an agenda focused on addressing income inequality and promoting public works. His top priority is a massive $3.5 trillion infrastructure, manufacturing, and clean-energy program "that appears likely to grow substantially if he is elected." He plans to pay for the program by raising the corporate tax rate from 21 percent to 28 percent and increasing taxes on wealthy real-estate investors. In the wake of the pandemic, Biden has "edged away from the moderate economic approach he advocated last year," but he is still not likely to "embrace punitive demands from the Left.""There is nothing 'moderate' about Biden's tax plan," said Mark Bloomfield and Oscar Pollock at The Wall Street Journal. For taxpayers with income above $1 million, Biden wants to tax capital gains as ordinary income. Combined with an upper-income tax increase, that would make top capital gains tax surge from the current 20 percent to 43 percent, exceeding the rate in "every one of the 10 largest economies." We are not going to compete with China by adopting "tax policies that discourage those who are best able to invest, take risks, and start companies."Certain industries are sure to be in Biden's crosshairs, said Anne Sraders at Fortune. "Trump's fight to lower drug prices will likely be carried on," meaning "potential headwinds for Big Pharma." And energy and "environment-sensitive industries" such as oil and gas production could underperform under a Democratic administration. But the naming of Kamala Harris as his vice-presidential nominee "might actually be good for Big Tech" because of her ties to Silicon Valley. For the first time in a decade, Wall Street donors are actually giving more to Democrats than to Republicans, said Jim Zarroli at NPR. Trump "still has friends in finance," but many investors have "soured on his management style," which makes it hard for them to make long-term plans.Whatever the outcome, investors are starting to worry about "stock-market mayhem" surrounding the November election, said Gunjan Banerji and Gregory Zuckerman at The Wall Street Journal. "Markets tend to be volatile ahead of elections," but pessimism about what might unfold appears "even more intense this time around." One adviser is urging clients to insure themselves against losses by buying options that will profit if the S&P 500 index plunges more than 25 percent through December; other firms are telling clients to bet on gold. The behind-the-scenes anxiety is unfolding even as markets hit a record high. "October and November tend to be the wildest months of the year" in any case, and market uncertainty could skyrocket if in the days after the election there is no clear winner.This article was first published in the latest issue of The Week magazine. If you want to read more like it, you can try six risk-free issues of the magazine here.More stories from theweek.com The Trump show has jumped the shark The only way Trump can win 6 things the GOP can learn from the virtual DNC
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| Jeremy Corbyn had 'tantrum' when he discovered he didn't have an electric battle bus, book claims Posted: 23 Aug 2020 09:29 AM PDT  Jeremy Corbyn had a tantrum when he discovered he didn't have an electric election battle bus, a new book has claimed. The former Labour leader was said to have grown disgruntled after travelling to Liverpool to for the unveiling of the party's battle bus, only to discover that it was run on diesel. An aide said Mr Corbyn had a "tantrum" after the discovery and text staff to say: "I see the [diesel] bus appears which I hope does not get too many negatives. As soon as rest of grid and operation notes are available can I get them so I can know a week ahead what is being planned and other requests that may appear can be factored in." His annoyance was said to be fueled by the fact that Jo Swinson, former leader of the Liberal Democrats, had an electric battle bus. In Labour's manifesto the party had promised to outlaw diesel busses by 2030. In response Marsha Jane Thompson, an aide in Mr Corbyn's office, said: "Once we win we can mandate investment in electric buses!" According to the book Left Out: The Inside Story of Labour under Corbyn, Ms Thompson then contacted the senior management team WhatsApp group to say: "JC unhappy that lib dems have an electric bus." As a result Mr Corbyn had to travel the country by train, which meant phone reception was unreliable. It was suggested that his lack of access to schedules and 'grids' during the campaign became a sticking point for the former leader, who began to insist he be dialed into conference calls at the start of each day, despite his large workload.
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| 'Everybody just started running': 3 people shot at Fayette Mall in Kentucky, police say Posted: 23 Aug 2020 05:13 PM PDT  Three people were shot inside a Kentucky shopping mall on Sunday in an incident that "does not appear to be random," police said.
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| TikTok creators are pretending to be Holocaust victims in heaven in a new trend dubbed 'trauma porn' Posted: 23 Aug 2020 09:16 AM PDT  A spokesperson for the US Holocaust Museum said it dishonored the memory of the victims, is offensive to survivors, and trivializes the history.
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| Portland protest turns violent, federal police clear plaza Posted: 22 Aug 2020 05:01 PM PDT  Images showed what appeared to be hundreds of people involved, many of them wearing helmets and carrying makeshift shields.
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| Democrats have a plan to disrupt Trump’s convention and cripple his message: report Posted: 22 Aug 2020 04:53 PM PDT  Democratic strategists plan to do everything they can to disrupt the Republican National convention
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| A wedding reception spread coronavirus to 53 people, killing a woman who didn't attend the event Posted: 23 Aug 2020 12:56 PM PDT  A wedding reception in Millinocket, Maine, led to 53 confirmed cases of coronavirus, nearly half of whom didn't attend the event, the local CDC said.
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| 2nd night of protests against GOP convention in Charlotte Posted: 22 Aug 2020 01:07 PM PDT  Protesters returned to the streets of Charlotte, North Carolina, to demonstrate for a second night as GOP officials gathered in the city for the Republican National Convention. Police used bicycles to block protesters Saturday night from gathering close to the Charlotte Convention Center, the site of the convention. The Secret Service set up a perimeter, news outlets reported.
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| Thousands evacuated as two storms head for southern US Posted: 23 Aug 2020 04:55 PM PDT  Hurricane Marco and Tropical Storm Laura are both expected to hit the southern US coast days apart.
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| There's concern a 3rd coronavirus wave in the U.S. could be 'more diffused,' less concentrated Posted: 23 Aug 2020 09:52 AM PDT  First, the good news. Former Food and Drug Administration Commissioner Scott Gottlieb told CBS News' Margaret Brennan during Sunday's edition of Face the Nation that there have been positive developments in the United States' battle with the coronavirus pandemic -- cases and hospitalizations are declining, and Gottlieb also expects deaths, a lagging factor, will start to trend downward soon, as well.The tide is turning as Sun Belt states like Arizona and Florida see improvements, but Gottlieb said there's still cause for concern. Cases are building in the West and Midwest, indicating a third wave -- the first being the early epidemic in the New York tri-state area, followed by the more recent explosion of cases in the Sun Belt -- could be coming.What has experts like Gottlieb particularly concerned is that if those states do see a significant flare-up "it could be more diffused" and "spread across a broader section" of the country. > Good news? COVID19 cases, hospitalizations and deaths are falling across the Sunbelt, @ScottGottliebMD tells @margbrennan. > > But, cases are building in the West and Midwest. It could lead to a third wave, and be more diffused - less concentrated. pic.twitter.com/MvV9FlDcuz> > -- Face The Nation (@FaceTheNation) August 23, 2020More stories from theweek.com The Trump show has jumped the shark The only way Trump can win 6 things the GOP can learn from the virtual DNC
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| Tennessee parents forced to sign waiver stating they will not eavesdrop on their children's online lessons Posted: 22 Aug 2020 04:35 AM PDT  This is just the tip of the iceberg, a Tennessee mom who homeschooled her five children warns.
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| Lukashenko says he will close Belarus factories that are seeing protests: RIA Posted: 22 Aug 2020 06:53 AM PDT  Belarus President Alexander Lukashenko said on Saturday he would close factories that have seen worker protests, the Russian RIA news agency reported, his latest attempt to quell a wave of opposition rallies since contested elections this month. Lukashenko also suggested he would fire the workers concerned. "If a factory is not working then let's put a lock on its gate from Monday, let's stop it," RIA cited Lukashenko as saying in the town of Grodno near the border with Poland.
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| Coronavirus latest news: Blood pressure medication can lower the risk of death from Covid-19 Posted: 23 Aug 2020 02:13 PM PDT  Blood pressure drugs may protect against Covid-19 effects Four million people could be tested daily by early next year Most English neighbourhoods 'haven't had a case for a month' PM appeals to parents to get children back to school Summer sale: Save 50% - Just £1 a week for 6 months Medication for high blood pressure lowers the risk of becoming seriously ill or dying from Covid-19 by one third, a study suggests. Researchers from the University of East Anglia studied 28,000 patients taking antihypertensives, a class of drugs used to treat high blood pressure. They found that the risk of severe Covid-19 illness and death fell by one third for people taking Angiotensin-Converting Enzyme inhibitors (ACEi) or Angiotensin Receptor Blockers (ARB) . Lead researcher Dr Vassilios Vassiliou, from the University of East Anglia's Norwich Medical School, said: "We found that there was a significantly lower risk of death and critical outcomes, so they might in fact have a protective role, particularly in patients with hypertension." Follow the latest updates below.
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| At one university, students' steps are tracked to stop the coronavirus Posted: 23 Aug 2020 03:01 AM PDT  The school president says students shouldn't be worried about privacy issues and the "Orwellian effect" because the data is collected for internal use only.
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| 'Not an easy task': GOP scrambles to finalize plans for convention amid COVID-19, venue changes, Trump input Posted: 22 Aug 2020 01:08 PM PDT  Planners still haven't provided a final schedule or other key details of the Republican National Convention, which opens next week.
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| Rapid coronavirus tests are being used to host private parties in the Hamptons Posted: 23 Aug 2020 09:45 AM PDT  The tests cost up to $500 per person and the results come back within 10 to 30 minutes. Still, public health experts say they're not fail-proof.
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| Police arrest 5 during RNC protests in Charlotte Posted: 23 Aug 2020 10:31 AM PDT  Police have arrested five people in Charlotte, North Carolina, where protesters demonstrated against the Republican National Convention for a second night. The arrests happened late Saturday after a group of demonstrators left a park and began to peacefully march throughout uptown Charlotte, police said in a statement Sunday. Police used pepper spray after a demonstrator picked up a steel pipe that was being used for perimeter security fencing and aggressively approached officers, police said.
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| Sen. Chris Coons on claims that Democrats ignored spike of urban violence, threat from China at DNC Posted: 23 Aug 2020 06:50 AM PDT  Delaware Sen. Chris Coons, Biden campaign surrogate, joins Chris Wallace on 'Fox News Sunday.'
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| China giving experimental coronavirus vaccines to high-risk groups since July, says official Posted: 22 Aug 2020 08:36 AM PDT |
| California wildfires: Dramatic footage shows helicopter rescue of firefighters surrounded by blazes Posted: 23 Aug 2020 05:23 AM PDT  The dramatic rescue of two firefighters who had become trapped by deadly wildfires in California can be seen in footage that highlights the danger the blazes pose.The Marin County Fire Department requested the urgent rescue of the firefighters who had become trapped on a ridgeline at Point Reyes National Seashore and were unable to make it out of the path of the advancing inferno at 8.15pm local time on Friday.
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| Soft drink or 'bottled poison'? Mexico finds a COVID-19 villain in big soda Posted: 23 Aug 2020 02:27 PM PDT  Mexican leaders link rampant soda consumption to COVID-19 deaths, blaming sugar for causing comorbidities such as obesity and diabetes.
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| A timeline of events related to the case of Elijah McClain Posted: 23 Aug 2020 08:17 AM PDT |
| Hong Kong activist Joshua Wong reveals fear of arrest Posted: 23 Aug 2020 08:12 AM PDT  Pro-democracy activist Joshua Wong told Sunday how he constantly feared arrest following the imposition of a new security law in Hong Kong, in a virtual appearance at British book festival.
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| The WHO just released specific mask guidance for kids as they gear up to return to school: children 12 and older should wear them as adults do Posted: 23 Aug 2020 07:30 AM PDT  The guidance is broken into age groups: kids over 12 should wear masks, kids under 6 shouldn't, and for kids in between, it depends on a few factors.
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